Favorite Players in the NFL Draft | This Is Football

[Music] all right Tom Fornelli is here one of my favorite uh journalist football college Pro whatever Sports uh I asked for your title you said renowned Italian yep uh Dan Puda I didn’t ask him if he was Italian but he was on the show on Tuesday an Italian week I mean it sounds Italian he might not be though no I think he is am I in trouble if I’m wrong on this one yeah oh yeah they we will come for you uh you also are the co-host of the cover three podcast I have to ask uh fresh off the news of the week which is

a fight at Starbucks have you ever gotten in a just a knockdown drag out argument because this wasn’t physical but it just just like a heated moment with a with another journalist Starbucks are not no I will say though I I maintain like I’ve I’ve been to that Starbucks and it’s a CD Starbucks I’m not surprised there was stuff going no just kidding but like I just I I nobody wins a fight to Starbucks let’s be honest you got to do it in the street or at a bar but no I have never been in a altercation with another journalist

media member whatever although I have seen an altercation which I’m not going to get into who it was in it but it was very heated I sometimes think about it this way and there’s a reason I’ve never been in like a real altercation with another journalist one it’s just not not my nature uh I’m really good at cutting lines that then end the argument like you just say something like that’s not what I heard and then walk away and then and then they’re in their own head why did he say that like what you just do

something like that you don’t do the actual confrontation but the thing about journalism fights and journalism feuds is that just think to yourself before you’re about to get in one what if I explained this to a normal person how would they feel about it like I am like boiling over with anger but if I explained this to like my uncle he’d be like what is happening right now so like the only time I’ve ever actually gotten some like someone was really really mad at me was um in a dolphins locker room I covered

the Dolphins when I was in college CLE lemman was the quarterback and I let a guy get like two or three questions alone which is really hard for a quarterback and then I kind of moved in and then then I butt in I think there’s there was a there there’s there’s a lot that goes into that like there’s a lot of etiquette and all that stuff I thought I was in the right on this one like there I can do all day on who gets one-on ones and and how long you get the one-on ones you can do all that all day but then the guy starts

screaming at me about buing in on Cleo lemon and I was like just let’s just just drive to 7-Eleven and find four people and be like these guys are yelling at each other over the buffer zone around Cleo lemon and that’s what we’re arguing about and I just wanted to see their faces right that’s that’s how you I think when I think about journalism fuds that’s why I don’t get any it was my turn to ask Cleo lemon to talk about how he felt about practice today exactly like that’s what we’re getting angry

over nothing we do matters that just most important thing nothing everything I do matters everything you do matters everything you do matters um what is uh what is the like so I don’t even really know the rhythms of a college football journalist right now I know you guys did a combined thing the other day but like I know the NFL rhythms because it’s the combine and then it’s the draft and then it’s the owners meetings and then it’s competition committee with the rule changes and all this stuff and then we

get a little bit of time off in May June July but then you also have mini camps and all that stuff and then you have training camp starting like what do you do right now I mean Spring football is just dead now no one’s G have a spring game anymore and like what’s Tom Fornelli doing right now uh if you’re chip Patterson you Lament The Death of spring practice if you’re me you’re just like cool I don’t have to talk about spring games and pretend that they actually matter anymore I I do think that we have talked about the spring

games because it is a change and it I yeah I do think there are there are ramifications from it but I don’t think it has anything to do with football as much as I just think that it has to do with media access and allowing reporters to yell at each other about not getting to answer questions but I think right now yeah the NFL combine is a big thing because I still feel like the players that will be drafted still belong to us yeah that’s true 100% true yeah until their names are selected they’re still

our children and we still get to talk about them and view that way and then they become adults who have graduated to the real world but I I think there’s a lot of that I think the nice thing about off seasons for us right now well nice is a relative term but the interesting thing about offseasons for us right now is that the sport changes every 15 minutes so we have that oras it’s like now you know the SEC and the Big 10 are doing their power play to get automatic burs into the playoff which they already

want to expand and they already want to change the seats and they already want to do all these other things even though they just did all of these things so that is the interesting stuff you’ve got the house rulings coming down as far as you know player like Revenue sharing all that kind of stuff that’s coming where now players are just straight up getting paid and now we’re trying to decide okay well how much are we going to you know put towards paying the players and how much the positions get will there be

salary caps all that kind of stuff so it’s just the Perpetual professionalization of the game that we’re kind of dealing with that kind of helps you get through the offseason but it also leads to a whole lot of I have absolutely no idea what any of this is going to look like because we haven’t had to deal with it before like we compare it to the NFL but it’s not the NFL at least not yet because the NFL has 32 teams who all with the same rules and the same goals College football at the FBS level is 134 teams who are parts of

different conferences all of whom have their own different goals and every single school has their own different goal like not all these schools are in this to win things they’re just kind of in it to maybe scrape a few dollars to help pay for their other sports wow I could never imagine NFL team just trying to make money and not prioritize winning I I’ve never seen it it’s about the competitive spirit and striving to be the all all in every year there’s no no team skimping on cash spending couple

things number one I think I’m going to spend 10 seconds on this I think there’s a thing right now where people think the house settlement is the US House of Representatives and not a guy Nam house they think it’s like a congressional thing and it’s not a congressional thing not even close to a congressional thing it will never be a congressional thing and I’ve seen that a lot like oh well Congress figured no they didn’t they know they didn’t house is a guy okay all right name like Tom house I can’t

remember his first not Tom Tom is a a former pitcher who uh ended up tutoring Tom Brady and uh yeah I I I did a story on Tom house Alex Smith big Alex Smith guy um all right so or Matt Castle maybe I’m not sure um all the Chiefs quarterbacks run together for Mahomes okay Gary Danielson uh Todd blackl who who was the who was the old guy who’s the guy in the booth who was the last the last uh Chiefs draft pick to win a game for the Chiefs it was either Todd blackw or Gary Danielson probably black I don’t probably guy

think it was some guy in a booth Ro cor started a game wasn’t drafted by the chiefs no no no no it’s was like a crazy thing it was like 25 years anyway uh the other thing is what you guys get is now what we get and that wasn’t the case so so for a long time the value of spring games for journalists was to see the depth chart and you got to say oh well this guy who was a five star two years ago is now in the plans at left defensive end he played every rep in the spring game he was you know he’s he’s

been the the alpha for every every open practice all that stuff don’t get that anymore no here’s what you get you get what we get you get to follow the money and you get to say so I remember when I was a young reporter and i’ I’d see I’d be at Dolphins practice with Cleo lemon and I would see like uh some random Michigan State undrafted free agent just balling out every single day every single day every single day and I go oh this guy’s showing out this guy’s GNA going to make the team and everybody else

whether they’re on the team whether they’re in the front office whether the reporters are like no he’s not because there’s four guys who have guaranteed money on their contract this guy just came in at this like I’m sorry like this is not it’s not actually camp training camp is not actually meritocracy right and so if you’ve got if you brought in two tackles two offensive tackles for $700,000 each and you’re a mid- major or a mid middle of the road power four team those are your starters those are your

starters there is no meritocracy now maybe in November that changes but you have the death chart it’s called money yeah I can’t wait I just I’m really looking forward to this era of college football it’s it’s super exciting for me to just you just get the death chart from the collective now instead of asking the coach just have the collective give you the the depth chart that’s actually probably I hadn’t thought of that but that is actually a route I should probably take now I can just ask that person just ask guy can

you give starting left tackle this year oh well this guy’s making 750 so it’s going to be him did you see Rick patino’s quote on college basketball in the Euro league the other day oh um I’m pardon my take yeah I listened to the interview I remember but I don’t remember exactly what it was but he good Rec that’s good recall there thanks Tom um no he said that the college basketball is now a carbon copy of the European League which is that it’s every single person’s on onee professional contracts and that’s

apparently the case in you know Greek basketball or Spanish basketball oneyear contracts if you if you play well you get more money or you go somewhere else to a bigger team the the thing that breaks my heart is that there are guys now like patino said he’s no longer recruiting high school players that’s gonna happen in college football like that’s going to happen in college football and there are going to be teams I don’t think it’s going to be Florida state Florida and Miami although Florida State rarely recruits high

school studs anymore um but that’s that’s that’s not a strategy necessarily that’s just kind of what happened um no I’m joking um but there will be teams where it Ben I don’t think it’s going to be those teams I be Texas but I think it’s going to be like Arizona State you know like that that level of Team where it’s like hey Miss is already doing Miss yeah where you’re just like why don’t we now that’s really expensive to do if you’re going to operate at the top of the transfer market like Texas Tech like Oregon like

old miss you you better have Deep Pockets but I don’t think that that’s I think that’s the future and then if you’re FAU you’re only a mid- major that’s all you’re you’re a jo at that point you’re a Jo and people will say hey I’m gonna go to FAU for one year and then maybe we get on Old Miss’s radar maybe we get on South Carolina’s radar maybe we get on Florida State’s radar like it is stunning what’s gonna happen to college fo I don’t know how you control it because no why why you wouldn’t sign a multi-year deal with FAU

you wouldn’t do it but you would go hey I’m going to go here for one year hope that I grow two inches is tight end and then all of a sudden I get to go play for for Bill b at UNC I I don’t know how you change that but it sucks as someone who just loves the entire College ecosystem it sucks yeah and I think it’s interesting too because like my my co-host Bud Elliot has brought this up where like the first few years the transfer portal there was kind of like a free-for-all and that players were just

entering and going but we saw this year like now with nil and the revenue sharing most of the top players who aren’t going off to the NFL are being paid to stay at their current school like you’re seeing most of the money go to guys to not leave and it reminds me a lot of like NFL free agency in that when it comes to every offseason there are always good free agents available but you rarely see like an elite NFL level player hit free agency they usually get extended or they’ll get the franchise

tag so like the idea of building a roster through the portal I think it’s going to be very hard for those teams like you’re saying the teams that are competing for national titles are still probably going to rely on recruiting five stars out of high school and developing them but like teams that just want to be like nine- win teams and maybe get a playoff birth and compete for that they can still live in the portal but I think it’s going be really hard to build a national title team do not not to bring up FSU but like that

the other thing I want to say before we get to actually what we’re doing here is that I I know everybody said this last year but I would watch the spring window because what I think happened was that there were big teams who didn’t know what the price was of a really good player and now you’re giving them three months to raise the money I’ll leave it at that like I just I just I’ve I’ve heard from what’s Mario got cooking Kevin what are you not telling me I would not I would not do any of that stuff um I just think that like that

from the from the people I know there’s just I I think the price is just going to be exorbitant I go back to something but Elliot said years ago which is people say oh it was nio for went for eight million and everybody’s like oh we can bust and it’s like yeah well If he if he wasn’t going to bust he’d be worth $20 million the bust factor is baked in you don’t think that these guys don’t know they were not going to bust like we’re good and as bud has said many times the there there’s not a finite

amount of rich people in these areas who want to be like that’s my guy like they should I’ve said this before to people in college I’m like you and like you know how it’s like uh some teams like Stanford they they have a chair for the coach it’s like yes we’re the Steve Johnson head coach of of Wake Forest or whatever right like like uh I’m trying to think of like a huge a huge transfer in this in this last Carson Beck it should be the uh you know the the I’m the Sylvester shalone he went to Miami

I’m assuming he’s G Shapiro honorary Miami Stallone honorary C quarterback is Carson Beck this year and it’s just like you sponsor him and like northwester and every single coach on their football staff is named after somebody like there’s the uh Darren rll running backs coach you know it’s it’s it’s crazy how they do that yeah when are you gonna when’s your Ali coach dropping what when is your Ali Co when when is your sponsored when am I GNA buy the Ali coach and what position coach would it be uh I would buy the special

teams coach and I will have to inquire on the price of that but I would be interested so Josh Whitman if you’re watching right now the Illinois athletic director reach out we’ll we’ll we’ll hammer out a deal here beautiful all right here’s what we’re going to do we’re going to do our favorite players from last year um in who were in this draft we’re not going to do underclassman we’re not about Jeremiah Smith um we’re gonna we’re gonna Dam I got to start over hold on we’re gonna use uh College IP to inform the pros and

I really like this because as you said these guys still belong to you you’ve watched them a lot more than and I too like I I I I watch so much of these guys through the prism of being a college football fan and not through the all 22 there are people who send me college all 22 I haven’t necessarily looked at a lot of it until the combine comes out and I can do Heights and weights and all that stuff and match it up but like right now I view this this particular draft as I do every year February 27th through the

prism of college football Fantom so we’re not to talk about Travis Hunter we’re not going talk about uh cam Ward we’re not talk much Sanders like those are obvious guys we’re talking about guys where we watched them and said holy cow this is a dude uh before I get to that real quick who do you think is gonna have the best career in this draft God that’s hard to say I I think Travis Hunter is the best football player in this draft me too will he have the best career I don’t know because if he’s going to try the two-way thing that

adds a certain level of difficulty to how impactful he can be and also if he focuses on playing corner with some wide receiver sprinkled in it’s hard to be like the you know playing corner like you can be great and not get that much recognition out of it so I think as long as he’s healthy Abdul Carter will have the quote unquote best career out of anybody in this class because I think that at his position with how important that is he’ll have like the pro bowls he might be on you know a really good team like he’ll

impact that kind of stuff so I think Hunter is the best player I think Carter might be the most impactful the the Abdul Carter injury thing was very strange to me over a 12-h hour period when from maybe he needs surgery maybe he’ll rest to he definitely doesn’t need surgery it gives me pause and there are people we we’ve now there’s a lot of um NFL draft Twitter people who annoy me and same and and part of it is that there’s this group of people who say nothing matters like oh oh you’re really going to drop him on your board because

of uh like these happens a lot with measurements where it’s like some guy runs like a 48 right and it’s like oh oh really cuz he ran in shorts you’re going to drop it’s like all let’s let’s be Pro information and then let’s consider that information you know oh you’re that St you’re gonna let you’re that stupid you’re G to let the Eagles have this guy it’s okay let’s all use all the information on our disposal the Abdul Carter thing is a big deal if you’re if if he’s tied with somebody on your board this matters if you think he’s you

think he’s Lawrence Taylor fine go ahead and say well with his foot injury he’ll be healthy there’ve been all sorts of guys who’ have missed their first you know Odell Beckham famously nobody could figure out what was going on his first Camp people were saying oh is this guy not tough whatever he did fine like there’s all sorts of guys who have had those issues Tren Aly was drafting guys with blown ACLS for like five years in San Francisco but it really does matter to me that Abdul Carter has this weird

injury thing yeah like I don’t know how serious the foot injury is but I do know injuries are scary like there have been a lot of athletes who’ve had their careers derailed by foot injuries that they either they never really truly heal or it just leads to other problems in their body like let’s go to the NBA right now a lot of Joel embiid’s problems physically stem from foot injuries he had earlier in his career I think they’re directly related so you look at that kind of stuff and it is scary now if it is not a serious injury

okay fine if it’s just a little stress fracture that should heal and not be a big problem that’s fine but you need to do that research to look into it but personally if I’m an NFL team with one of the first nine picks in this draft I am staying far away from Abdul Carter I would take him at 10 though at the Bears yeah yeah um so that one coming a mile away hey um let’s get to your list who’s number one uh this is a player who I have said I thought was the most impressive player I saw in college football this season

and it’s it’s Donovan Jackson the guard turn tackle at Ohio State who going in like going into the offseason you saw him in mocks or in draft boards as like one of the better interior linemen in the next class he missed the first few games of the 2024 season because he was injured he comes in plays left guard where he’s supposed to be playing and plays pretty dang well and then Josh Simmons Ohio State’s starting left tackle gets hurt he’s done for the year Ohio State’s already had other injuries

on their offensive line so what did they do they asked Jackson to kick out from guard to play left tackle and his first game at left tackle is against Penn State and do you know who they happen to line up against him on nearly every single snap the injured footman himself yeah Abdul Carter and Abdul Carter wears his ass out like it was a disaster he got absolutely destroyed you watch the tape on that game and I don’t think there’s a single pass rush snap that that Donovan won I think even when it

wasn’t Carter he was losing but then he figured it out and as the season wore on and he got more experience at the position he started playing really well then when you get to the playoff where they’re playing off against you know Tennessee Texas Oregan and then Notre Dame and the national title game he was one of the he was probably the best offensive lineman on the field in most of those games as far as performance so seeing this guy play guard where he was already very good get asked to move to left tackle for the

team to help them out where he’s not doesn’t have much experience and was very overmatched in his very first game to improve the way that he did to the fact where I thought he was one of the best linemen on the field in those games against other Elite competition I just thought it was one of the most impressive things I’ve seen and while you won’t see him in the first round of many mocks I most people don’t even consider him the best guard in the class I think that’s a guy if I’m an NFL GM and I need an offensive lineman like I’m

drafting him as a guard and I think he could start and be a very good guard in the NFL but just the ability that he showed me to play those multiple positions in a tough spot against really good good competition that leads me to believe this guy is going to be a good NFL player and I will be able to use him at different spots across my line love that I think there’s so many teams need interior help especially if he as you mentioned if he’s not a first- round pick if he’s in the second you think

about the Chargers you think about the Jaguars teams just need help there um I really I really like that um I also love like I’m going to get to this in a second like the journey like these guys are playing so many more games than they used to and even with the injuries but like you’re able to see it on tape like okay this guy’s getting better game after game that’s a that’s good we have we have we have more data points we ever had before so I love that I also think and this something I brought up on the

show like think there’s going to be an eagles effect where teams are just like let’s just be good on the lines and and then let’s just solve that problem until then we can go draft a wide receiver I think there’s there’s going to be a lot of that and I think that’s the kind of guy where it’s like let’s take this guy and then and you know he’s he’s big and nasty and and we just he’s a guy we want to team so I I I I think guys like that are going to be incredibly valuable in this draft Yeah and in my latest marck I

think it was 22 of the 32 guys I had in the first round either offensive or defensive lineman because I I do think that like the we’ve talked about the NFL is a copycat league and you know it’s not just scheme like it’s like well look at how the Eagles just did this with a huge defensive line and a huge offensive line and tons of depth that’s what it takes to win in the National Football League let’s all run out and get those guys and I also think part of it too and we’ll get to this later like you

mentioned taking these guys ahead of wide receivers and stuff like I don’t think this is a great wide receiver class like when I look at the skill positions in this draft outside of a couple of running backs like Ashton jenty particularly but I don’t think it’s that great so I think that’s going to lead to even more of a run on like interior lineman whether it’s on the offensive or defensive side of the ball I’m gonna talk about running backs right now not gonna say Ashen jenty I think Ashen jent is the best running back here

I want I I want to say this though so I did not favor Ashen ginty for Heisman um and nether did die what’s that neither did die I voted for Travis yeah I told uh I believe I told Ashton jenty that like we I said I was at the Heisman Ceremony and he said what you think and I I have to tell him like my whole thing is like I can’t say something publicly and then not say to somebody’s face right he was fine with this when I told him this I he’s fine with it but that happened recently when I had Tony Khan

on the show and I was talking about how I loved uh Liam Cohen hire I do like the James godstone hire but I had to say he looks exactly like you of course you like that higher I had to say like I did not like the GM setup before because otherwise listeners to the show listen to every episode God help you but they’re going to be like wait you you’ve been killing balky for four months and then you have the owner on the team on the show and you’re like you’re doing a bang up job you have to say that stuff I just feel like you have

to say that stuff so I’ve informed Ash and jenty of this he was an amazing guest going to be a great running back and he’s going be a great first- round pick I think that there was this weird internet thing where we started to do and I don’t know what the hell happened we started to just start saying that the G5 guys with the best stat should win the awards like that happened with Harold fayan that happened with this guy Nick Nash from San Jose State what are we doing this is not we’re not we’re not doing just the

sort by yardage thing here guys we’re not doing that all right we’re not doing the video game this is not the video I I’m gonna leave it at that I love Ash and Genty um so I’m not gonna do him because he’s so obvious and I say let’s let’s leave out the obvious guys um I’m gonna say talk about Caleb Johnson real quick yep because I think he’s a day one starter on a wide Zone team you saw that a little bit on tape his contact balance is unbelievable he’s tough he’s huge I have his measurements in front of me not

the combo measurements but the just the the roster uh measurements uh 6 foot 225 pounds um 22 receptions on the year so he can do a couple other things but like he just runs hard and he just seems like the type of I the older I get one of the things that I’ve come to appreciate in talking to players who know a lot more about football than I do it’s like hard Runners and I put jenty in this category obviously nobody wants to go on the field with them like if you’re a defensive linean you’re like God darn it

like I re I got to deal with this guy and like when I see a hard Runner I want I want him on my team I need at least one hard Runner and like you’ve got them in this draft Damen Martinez the way he hit creates contact leans into contact gets runs through guys like I love those types of players Caleb Johnson to me great vision great contact balance um the type of guy that that wins games starting next year yeah and the thing about Caleb Johnson is like he’s not scheme dependent like you could put him

in a gap scheme and he’d be fine but he is truly Elite unlike outside Zone runs like his vision and all that stuff finding the lane and then hitting it and just making the cut and going and just running through the contact is very good it’s like I imagine him in like a Shanahan offense just absolutely rushing for like 1,800 yards a season and 15 touchdowns completely agree completely agree all right here’s your number two uh number two I mentioned it I don’t think the wide receiver class is great

and I think when you look at a lot of the mocks you see tedo and McMillan going you know the first wide receiver taken first round pick and I get it he’s very big he’s very talented he’s got a lot of things you want like I’ve seen a lot of people compar him to Drake London to me reminds me more of like a t Higgins kind of player but there’s a discount taroa McMillan I think as far as not ability and talent but just the price to get him his name is Trey Harris and he played at Old n he started his

career at Louisiana Tech he transferred because again as we said earlier in the show L kind of lives in the transfer portal but he missed a lot of this season because of an injury and as long as his health checks out and I think it will I think this is a tremendous value because he was again like Donovan Jackson he was somebody who a year ago at this time when you were doing the like way too early mock for 2025 he was somebody that by way which by the way is just the recruiting ranking is from two

years prior yes yes yes you see that so like I I forget what it’s called like the home the home team test where where you just look if you’re trying to figure out if a guy is legitimate analyst you just look at what he says about your team the team you know the most and you figure figure out if he’s good or not you you find in those mocks the guys on your team and it’s always the five star from two years prior always and it’s just some guy who fired Up 3 the 32 five stars from 247 two years prior and then

just go oh yeah this guy like he play as long as they play that was the thing with James Williams in Miami he was play Leonard Taylor they were playing they weren’t particularly great but they were playing as five stars so way too early mocks they’re all going like ninth anyway dud so like Harris is you know he’s 6’3 he’s 210 lbs he’s got the frame he’s got the long arms he’s got like everything that you want in that like that kind of X receiver that outside receiver and and he’s an absolute beast

when it comes to like contested catches which I think is one of those things that really translates well from receivers for college to the NFL like you see a lot of guys who catch passes while they’re wide open because they get schemed open in college and then they go to the NFL where you’re never going to be that open and they struggle Trey Harris what he’s done in college yes he gets schemed open but he also goes up and wins battles against Defenders to get the ball and I think that is very valuable and I also have my own metric

that I created like for wide receiver efficiency I guess is the best way to describe it at the college level in his two years at Old Miss he’s the number one receiver in the country in this metric he was higher than Malik neighbors he was higher than Marvin Harrison he’s higher than Jeremiah Smith like he has been that impactful and that effective on on the field and I look at him like he does get dropped sometimes like he will if you hit him right in the hands and there it’s funny because he’s

so good at contested catches sometimes when he’s wide open he just completely loses concentration and he will drop one and that is a problem but just his size his ability to get downfield and he’s fast he’s not going to run like 4-3 but he’ll probably run in like the four5 like this is a guy who I think is being overlooked and another thing about him that is very important to me and I think it is very important to NFL teams especially with the schemes we’re seeing them run and how the offenses are

changing in the NFL blocks his ass off like he’s big and he plays like he’s big he’s not afraid to block a guy if he’s being asked to do so you see a lot of receivers who they’re very effective with the ball in their hands but when they know the ball’s not coming to them me whatever I’ll do what I got to do this is a guy who plays hard on every single snap and I look at him right now and I feel like he’s got like third round tag on him third fourth round I guarantee you Trey Harris will be better

than at least half the receivers drafted ahead of him be better than tedo and McMill Ben Johnson the other day said no block no rock for receivers damn straight like every it’s not a coincidence every single Elite offense at college and especially in the NFL all have receivers who Block it’s not a coincidence it is not a coincidence um the other thing I was going to say was that the contestant catch King dropping wide open passes we’ll call that since Super Bowl the down Hopkins the best contested catch Maestro of his

generation wide open and just floop on a on a little drag route well I mean for nuke at this point like there were plenty of times when he was younger when he was getting wide open but he’s lost a step so he’s just not used to being that open anymore so I I I forgive him for that there another word for him right now it’s nuked yeah nuked um apparently he’s not retiring I don’t know where that came from like apparently Andy Reid was like he’s going to retire and then he was like I’m not going to retire it’s

like okay I not to be I he had an amazing career but at some point the league tells you if you’re going to yep retire so we’ll see what happens um I I want to love from keep playing he’s a great personality he’s a great ambassador to the game um he’s going to have an amazing chapter after football whenever that is um anyway uh I got a second one here and so this is about pass rushers and to me like James Pierce seems to be falling for some reason um but his explosion rate like his the amount of of quick sacks I don’t know if

you SE see those stats like it’s off the board off the charts like he gets after guys and it sounds like uh he might not be a fit in every locker room or whatever I don’t know I’m taking I’m taking that guy he’s not what I’m about to say but like I’m taking that guy reminds me a little bit of Jaylen Carter a couple years ago where the tape was just screaming at you and people were like oh he may not fit every it’s like okay well I don’t know man can he can he Maul quarterbacks I think we can figure

out something to do with him um he can run him down that’s sure yeah he can run him down and you know maybe in those situ situations veteran team they drop and then the veteran teams are able to work him in more and you know it’s a better environment for him and then you end up with Jaylen Carter uh for instance uh but for me the guy I saw on on film this year and and God bless me I watch a lot of ACC football I watch a lot of football uh I’m gonna go with uh well I mean I think I think I think I know who

you think I’m going to guess and I don’t think it is go ahead is it Ashton gelot that’s who I thought you were going to guess and it’s not okay damn uh for me so I really like him I let’s talk about him for a second I really like him uh he’s fast um that Louisville defense did not have a lot of Playmakers but he he he was bringing on every single rep I thought I thought that that he was really good he’s a type of guy I thought that maybe there’d be higher more more buzz on him um going into this draft

because of how much Buzz there was on him going into the NFL season what happened like what what what why what happened to him I I think the concerns about gelotti are probably mostly based around his ability to be like a three down player because you do have concerns about his setting the edge against the run but I think just as a situational pass rusher if somebody’s going to get a very good player in Ashton Jui if you could do one thing well I want you on my team I don’t want you on the first round but like

yeah but for me um Antoine pal Ryland from from Virginia Tech so this is a very dangerous thing thing for me to do because none of these pass rushers have tested okay so he might be off my board in like three hours I don’t even know when they start doing this stuff but with pass rushers you have to have a certain level but um Peebles on Virginia Tech defensive line was also very good but I have I have size concerns with him with with um with power Ryland what I like is that it was funny I was reading a Scouting Report

from Len zerand I think this morning and they’re basically saying like he’s got a violent punch and is Crafty and those are the types of guys who play eight years in this league yep and he’s 252 lbs uh we’ll see kind of what the scheme fit is but I really liked watching that Virginia Tech defensive line this year um they were not I don’t think the Virgin Tech is the most well coach team in the world obviously it took them they got a new defensive coordinator took them a long time to to hire one we’ll

see what happens with that entire program going forward I think that they’re not to go too far down this rabbit hole but like um Virginia Tech to one of these programs needs to get good really quickly because college football is changing and you can’t no one’s going to be like does anybody remember the 1999 Sugar Bowl not gonna happen my advice for Virginia Tech is to get very good very quickly anyway my my my thoughts on Ryland are I wonder if he’ll be better at the NFL because at the NFL level because when I watched

Virginia Tech play particularly on the defensive side of the ball this year and even on their defensive line I saw a lot of talented players I don’t know if I saw a lot of well- coached players yeah but but those are the types of guys you get had 25 and a half sacks over two years okay I think he had 47 pressure something like that one of the top pass rushers in the ACC it’s the type of guy you want and you say we can fix him it’s a gross overe exaggeration when I say this but it’s just gets to the

heart of what I’m trying to say is like I feel like there was a lot of backyard football in that Virginia Tech defense it was like all right see ball go get ball yeah whereas it wasn’t worri like there were too many times I would watch where it’s like guys were not maintaining what you would think their responsibilities would be and I don’t sit here and pretend I’m some sort of Guru when it comes to defensive scheme and all that kind of stuff like I I can’t tell you what a guy’s responsibility is it’s just I watch a

lot of tape and when I watched Virginia Tech I saw things that guys were doing or not doing that I see in most other teams it was just kind of confusing at times but I do agree just athletically he flashes he’s big he’s strong he’s got good first step but I do think he is somebody who does not have a ton of Polish and I wonder if getting him into an NFL training camp somebody just says Hey dummy you’re doing it wrong this is what you’re supposed to be doing if you could see him take a step I’d be

surprised if he was anywhere near as athletic as jayx hunt last year but like jayex Hunton was a Houston Christian the tape didn’t line up with the athleticism at all but they got him into the e e Les and so so hunt was on was kind of on this show we did a sort of a quick hitter l Johnson stories thing at the Super Bowl and at the first uh the first time Hunt went against Lane Johnson training camp Johnson threw him up field so violently that hunt apologized for trying to cross chop them okay and then I he said well

it took me until week 13 to beat him to Lan beat Lane Johnson and it’s like you want talk about the Eagles and what they’re able to do Clint hurt the defensive line coach Vic fer the defensive coordinator everything is well thought out there but it’s like they took a guy from Houston Christian in the middle rounds of the draft because he had athleticism because he was raw and he went from apologizing to Lane Johnson to beating Lane Johnson in practice in week 13 that to me is that’s developmentI don’t think it happens ever in college football I don’t think anybody actually develops in college football I think what we call development is actually just weight room and then like maybe a couple of to watch film stuff but like that is Real Deal development we taught you how to play football over 16 weeks that’s it and that’s why I think with pass rushers you just take these guys who can do a couple of things well who Flash the skill set in the middle rounds and say come with us buddy hop on my

back we’re we’re we’re putting you in the defensive player of the year conversation in three years yeah I I think there are just some positions in Ed rushers is one of them where I do not care about their production at the college level I mean I do like are you about to drop Shamar Stewart yeah there’s just I think that’s one of those positions where NFL teams look at him it’s like I I don’t care if he only had five sacks I’m looking at what I can do with him and I think that’s like Edge rusher is one of those positions where

size Speed and Agility and all that kind of stuff the moldability of the player I think matters far more to these teams than their actual production which isn’t to say production doesn’t matter it does I just don’t think it’s as important at that position as it is others uh well Al Nolan speaking of Texas A&M now Old Miss also another intriguing proect my faor class yeah um Shamar Stewart um sorry Shar Turner can one of those I got mixed those two guys up for for three years I’m glad they’re going to go to another

team and I can stop doing that stuff um shmar Turner there is the case to be made and I’ll make it now that in a couple of years the how did Hugh freeze like not win more with AJ Brown and DK Mecha that that whole meme I think we’re going to be talking about that techm team for a long time in that regard when all these guys get to the NFL and Flash wouldn’t surprise me yeah and Jimbo just really wasted the hell out of some players he sure did um all right who’s your next guy uh I look at the safety position a lot like running back

of the defense and the guys I am typically drawn to burn bright burnot and burn out real fast but I still love them which is why I wouldn’t take them in the first round but I definitely want them on my football team for three to four years and the one player I feel that way deeply about in this class is Texas’s Andrew makuba he started his career at Clemson transferred to Texas he’s uh if you watched him he wasn’t great in the title game or not the title game in the semis against Ohio state that was the one time where I feel like

he struggled this year but he was also a big moment player like his best games to me outside of the Ohio State game or in all of Texas’s big games whether it’s both the Georgia games the Michigan game any kind team that was like you know this is a big one he was at his best I love his mentality in that he is not shy he wants to hit you he’s a very violent player but he does it within the rules of the game at least he tries to do it within the rules of the game but it’s football you’re moving around fast

sometimes oops I targeted you that happens but he’s really good in coverage like I’m not putting him on your best receiver but I think he’s good enough at that position to cover somebody uh he’s really good against the run so you can bring him down to the box he wasn’t asked to do it a lot at Texas but I have seen him on tape I think he’s useful as a Blitzer you can bring him and he could do a solid job for you there so he’s very versatile he played at different spots like he’s for free safety but at

times Texas used him in the nickel spot against nickel receivers there was even a few times they lined him out wide at corner so he’s versatile he’s violent he plays really hard my only concerns on him are like I said these guys tend to burn burn out quick especially when they are playing as angry as Andrew makuba does and he’s not huge like he’s not weak he’s very strong but he’s not like thick and I worry about how that could hold up at the NFL level over the long run and he also does have a tendency to

sometimes miss a tackle because he’s trying to kill a guy more than make the tackle safeties are hard to evaluate because there’s so much go there so many times great safeties are having to do like eight people’s jobs because it’s a bunch of college defensive backs and college defensive backs typically have no idea what they’re doing and so if you’re really good as a safety you’re kind of all over the place because you’re just you’re the captain of a bunch of guys it’s like it’s not unlike I I could make a

lot of analogies to like my toddler playing with like his buddies they play hockey now downstairs and uh he runs the game I’d say he run he runs the hockey game um but it’s it’s it’s an interesting thing there I completely agree with that that Texas team was just stacked that and they’re going to be stacked for a long time um and I I I like the idea of Texas returning to being a uh a NFL Factory yeah like it’s this isn’t a knock on Jade Baron who won the Thorp award yeah but as good as I thought Baron was I I watched that Team

all year and I was like he’s not even the best defensive back on his own team we hadna a couple years ago with Kobe Bry s Gardner was the was the best player like in the history of the of the freaking program that’s not true but like and meanwhile it’s like we’re going to give all the awards to co this guy Kobe Bryant like sometimes we don’t know what we’re looking at yeah and I I felt that way watching Texas it was like okay like sure I mean I’m not he’s very good I don’t I think Travis Hunter was better

I would have given him the Thorp award but I don’t again I don’t even think he’s the best DB on his own team but cool good for him Travis Hunter is the best DB on his own team yes Travis I listen I I think the moment Travis Hunter steps on an NFL practice field he’s one of the 10 best corners in the NFL so there’s a lot of people week saying they see him as a wide receiver and I’m I’m incredibly confused by this I I think he has the ability to be a really good wide receiver if he dedicated himself to that

position I think he could be one of the best in the NFL wa can I can I give you a Travis Hunter take on that issue so I asked um Justin Pew on the radio how how often does playing football hurt how often is it like holy crap like I need to like you know wrap my hand I need a little ice I need to stretch that out and it’s like it’s about once a game that you just get you just get a hit or someone steps on your on your foot or whatever and Dominique Foxworth I asked him same question he said probably the same probably just

gets you get thwacked a little bit and like the kind of thing where if you could you ask out the game for like one play and then come back in it’s probably happens like once game but sometimes you just can’t you just can’t do it either you don’t have a good backup or it’s contract of your as Dominique said or or you can go through it whatever when you’re playing defensive back and wide receiver how many play it’s not like playing defensive end and left tackle how much contact you actually going through over a game

Travis not much because especially he’s playing wide receiver nobody was ever able to stay near who’s like nailing Travis Hunter he did get the last rated spleen from that Colorado State game last year because he took a dirty hit that’s the thing the biggest hit he took was a dirty kind of post whistle hit now he is not somebody that gets hit a whole hell of a lot right so I’m thinking now I was thinking in the beginning and I’ve said this like you play on a cornerback 20 snaps and wide receiver I’m thinking maybe take 10

snaps off his plate a cornerback and then maybe get closer to 6040 maybe I don’t know n i’ I’d rather have him play primarily at corner and then sprinkle a few plays for him on offense a few like 10 no like maybe 10 snaps but yeah no I meant 10 snaps yes not not 10 receptions I’m not asking for 10 receptions from I’m trying to get the ball in his hands on offense three to five times a game at most okay all right I I disagree with you um I would use him I would use him more like the Otani football who but Otani was only able to

play one way because of that because they used him both is it true is that true I he hurt like every pitcher every pitcher gets hurt now but he had to DH because of it yeah can’t even play the field well isn’t he back as a pitcher yeah we’ll see I I mean he’s CH Otani he’ll probably be pretty good again I heard he was back as a pitcher I looked into it I don’t know um I’m going to give you my third so clearly I think cam Ward is going to be the best player in this draft I’ve talked about it I don’t

want to do it again think Str Sanders is very good talk me out of my qb3 because I’ve heard a lot of people talk about Jackson Dart Jackson Dart Jackson Dart and now I heard last week I heard some people talking about Tyler shock guys do you know we can hear you these tweets are public these these these pods are public we can go back and listen to these all right so I’m more I don’t think there is a qb3 I think qb3 is a developmental Prospect in this draft I you know what I mean I don’t think there’s a qb3 where it’s like I’

gonna stake my claim on him except I’m starting to think that the qb3 in this draft and I’ve heard people make the case for will Howard and I’m fine with that it’s almost like the STS and Bennett argument from a couple years ago hey he wins whatever fine but when I think about the modern college football Journey it’s somebody who uses the portal finds a home gets better my qb3 I think is Kyle mccor yes yes he’s uh listen he’s got a big old arm he knows how big arm he got better as his career went on and as the season

went on he had the nightmare game against pit on the road yes that was bad but guess what that’s we’re not trying to take him eighth overall we’re trying to take him in the the bottom of the third top of the fourth that that kind of level if he impresses and all that stuff to me he’s the type of guy like Tanner mcke played an NFL game this year guys like to me he’s the type of guy a good quarterback coach would want to get in and say let’s let’s work with this guy thousand per. I I I took so much

heat last year when Ohio State you know basically kicked mcord out and kind of blamed him like they whether intentionally or not they put a lot of blame for their shortcomings on Kyle McCord and then they go and get will Howard and my thought process at the time was how much of an upgrade really even is that like McCord’s a much better passer I get that Howard’s more mobile but if you watched Ohio State this year didn’t really take advantage of Howard’s Mobility outside the Red Zone but I guess that’s ultimately where they

wanted to improve but like McCord going back to high School his teammate was Marvin Harrison Jr he goes to Ohio State his teammate’s Marvin Harrison Jr so much of his career was like yeah but he’s been throwing to Marvin Harrison Jr so he goes to Syracuse you know what Syracuse does not have Marvin Harrison Jr they did they did have a r Gadson Junior kind of they had another Neo receiver but like he goes to a Syracuse team that like hey give Fran Brown their new Coach credit he did a good job of like in the portal bringing

in some good talent on that roster but nothing like what he was dealing with at Ohio State and he had a fantastic season and I I agree with you I would rather have Kyle McCord than Jackson Dart who I think very he’s in an RPO offense like he wasn’t asked to do a whole lot he wasn’t asked to read much as far as defenses are concerned it was if this guy does this we’re doing this and that was really all he had to do um Tyler Shu Big Arm but can’t stay healthy other guys like Dylan Gabriel just small small

accurate but not a big arm so like there’s there’s probably a backup role for him but I’m not trying to draft a guy where it’s like oh I feel like this guy could be a good backup think dlan cord could be a starter in the NFL if he figures things out does Ohio State win The Natty this year with Kyle McCord a quarterback yeah me too I agree I mean I the only like the knock on him the year before was their red zone offense was putrid and bringing in will Howard and at least the right of his legs helped that but I also think

what re helped more than anything was bringing in Quin Johan Judkins because they didn’t really have that kind of short yardage goal line back on the roster Smith also helped Yeah well yeah you just throw the ball but theoretically Marvin Harrison should have been able to fill that role too I agree so no I I do think Ohio state would still be at least in that running like maybe they don’t win it maybe they lose you know because they played some close games but I don’t think if they did lose it would have been Kyle

McCord’s fault although Ohio State wanted you to know it was Kyle McCord’s fault when they lost to Michigan but then guess what happened again this year when you played an even worse version everybody got mad at him because after mord beat Miami and and then then Michigan beat Ohio state that day and he kind of gave like a what was the was like a smirking like small world or something like that and it’s like he’s allowed to have that he’s allowed to have that got like Ohio State fans dogged him for

months and I know you you’re you’re shocked by the idea that Ohio State fans would do that but it’s true they did a college fan base being weirdly aggressive acting like morons it’s it happens from time to time it does I I’ve never seen it but I’m gonna take your word for it I’ve never seen a college football fan base act weird about a kid that’s never happened um all right buddy any other takes you want to unleash uh this draft class stinks yeah so um I get what you’re saying saying I think it’s every draft

class is good like every even like the 20 2013 draft class which stunk and Deion Jordan’s going top five like the Chiefs got Eric Fischer and Travis Kelce in that draft it’s a skill issue for some teams um I think honey badger was in that draft like there there are guys there are guys it just we maybe because the portal maybe because of some other reasons like it just seems like um this is a a down year because it’s not topheavy I still value yeah I think like here’s a hot take I don’t know the exact

math on this but just who cares it’s a hot take I don’t need math to support it I think you see more pro bowlers drafted in the third round and later in this class than you do in the first I agree that’s happened before 2013 is as good think it’s one of those kind of classes and we named them we named them just now all six and K mcor comic cour is going be 11 times I can’t wait until the what’s it’s 2025 the 20 45 NFL Hall of Fame induction when it’s all the guys we named this podcast all the guys and Ohio State fans

are still mad uh like you know Marvin Harrison the third is playing for Ohio State at this point and somehow we’re still extremely mad all right buddy uh what else what do you got cooking at uh at CB CBS uh not much honestly we just keep doing the podcast three times a week Mondays Wednesdays Thursdays and doing some writing next week you’re looking forward to to it I I have no idea what I’m going to do I have to write my first offseason quarterback Power Rankings and I have legitimately no idea who to put

at number one I have some ideas hey I know what your ideas when am I coming on you invite just so the listener knows you invited me two years ago I couldn’t come on it was like a a scheduling thing and then it wasn’t anything other than a scheduling thing and then last year you said can you come on and then the week you said I wanted to you me to come on I shed in and he said blame norel because Florida state had lost so much juice that I was there was no longer any reason to preview Miami Florida State

you were to talk about losers from the from the two win fora State team talking about Mike norell you’re talking about uh obviously uh like every single transfer guy they got every single one stunk yes DJ dju like all of these guys they all stunk none of them were good and then me and I’d put me near the top the the the plan was for those who don’t listen to our show my three co-hosts one is Chip Patterson and the other two are Danny canel who maybe you know he went to Florida State and bu Elliot to a big

Florida State guy so Chip and I had this plan where the week of Miami Florida State we weren’t gonna tell Danny and Bud we were just gonna kind of have you come in like WWE Style the music just suddenly hits and all of a sudden who knew The Rock was in the arena they just G to have you come in and just the three of you go at each other for like a whole 20 minute segment while chip and I just sat back here’s the issue I don’t know how much Janie knows so am the only interaction I’ve had with him is that um

he is so I have a place in St Augustine I think he does as well maybe I don’t remember but um he gave me great St Augustine recommendations to National Championship a couple of years ago and and I introduced myself because uh he was rill’s co-host that’s the only interaction I’ve ever had so this could have flopped by him not knowing why it was the bud would have to carry it and we don’t want to put too much on Bud’s plate well see I think the the Marquee match up would have been you versus bud

anyway because you guys are but it was it was a tough corner for Bud by that October date in September pointless yeah bud was dead at that point he know he was like I don’t he was like why are we even talking like we would do recap shows or we bring up Florida State he like why are we even talking about this team they are meet they are pointless they don’t do anything whereas like Danny for his online Persona way too nice like I don’t feel like he would have gotten into the vibe he’ just been like yeah Kevin’s right yeah no no that

push back that’s why I’m glad that you um you you killed the second man I will say I had a thing uh with Sam AO right before Miami lost to Georgia Tech right before so like the Thursday maybe and I had concerns about the defense but but Sam had said on College bow live or see it said something about Miami that they couldn’t win national championship or something like that and I we were in line in Bristol and I was like hey Sam I think I we never worked on a show together and I was like I you know I I am I went to Miami I think

Miami can win the national championship and we had like a 25 minute discussion getting caesar wraps at the Bristol thing and I was like 10 toes down that Miami can do it even though they have a is this like a Starbucks situation no no no no no it was it was incredibly friendly um and he’s a great guy he’s like one of the nice people at ESPN and um uh my my feeling on it was they would have to Baker Mayfield Oklahoma they would have to win these games 50 to 48 which ended up being correct um they

just lost at the wrong time um but then we lost to Georgia Tech that Saturday and it was an awful game because all the things they always do well the short yardage stuff it was just like guys slipping on fourth and one like you play that game 9 Syracuse game whatever okay but you play that Miami game against at Georgia Tech 100 times Miami wins a whole lot of them I think Syracuse and Miami was always going to be a coin flip on the road with that level of offense against that defense whatever so we lose

this I’m sitting in my living room and all I can think of is I have embarrassed myself so much in front of s Mao like I have not followed up with Sam Mao about this but the whole like for like an hour I was like Sam Macho thinks I’m the biggest clown in the world like I was like I was like Charlie in the in the mail room scene and it’s always start in Philadelphia about how Miami can win the national championship and then we lose to Georgia Tech 48 hours later it’s like if you walk into the cafeteria next time

and you see AO in there you’re just going to like leave and I I I might be like no I’m leaving the company to never see Sam acho in case he remembers how Vigilant I was about I mean I I think it’s better to have that conversation with Sam than Emanuel all right buddy talk to you soon [Music]